Streetneat Paint Advice Needed

It sounds like you have a fair grasp of it.
I have to go to work now so will answer more later.

In short epoxy prime straight after blasting. Inside and underside surfaces can be etch primed to save epoxy primer - do this last as any epoxy going over etch will be a problem. Its OK the other way around.

Seam sealing is s done at last priming before wet rubdown and final seam sealing is done prior to paint.

Rust proofing is done after priming prior to wet rubdown - being careful not to cover the cars surfaces to be painted in rust proofing as this can / will affect painting.

If adding stripes - the whole panel is rubbed down. Stripes applied then the whole panel cleared.

I will answer this in more detail when I get home tonight.
Cheers streetneat-Andrew.

nm

Marking thread too.

Thanks you Andrew :-)

Looking forward to the next installment :-)

I have a couple of questions, but I'll hold off for now.

Don't mind me, I'll just sit over here and watch....

Once again - I have to go to work, so I will aim to be brief and concise. There is a lot of information to answer such a lot of questions and to reply properly. Some other experts will probably disagree with some of my pointers. It comes down to what I have found works in my 20 plus years of experience and there is no point arguing over two ways to do something right. Some guys will go about some of this a bit differently - that doesn't automatically make them wrong.

1. Garnet blasting is followed by removing all sand with air and vacuum cleaners followed by a thorough going over with some 80 grit on the orbital sander to remove traces of what the blaster left and any rusty fingerprints. Acid etch only if there is a patch of rust - dont acid etch the whole car. Go over the acid etch area with the sander after its dried. You dont want to introduce water at this stage!

2. Air blow the surfaces to be epoxy primed and palm off as you go. If you are a naturally sweaty person - stop right now! Sweat is by far the worse contaminant at this stage. Dont wear deodorants either as they are laden with silicone. Try to minimise the use of rags just now too. Rags just leave fluff behind. Make sure your sander hasnt sprayed oil on the surface . If it has - use wax and grease remover then sand it again. Wax and grease remover at this stage can cause problems as it can be oily and leave a residue. Always be wary of wax and grease remover. Go over it with metho if in doubt.

3. Epoxy priming of all outer surfaces and inners too if you have the funds to spend on epoxy on the inside. Just remember its important on all painted surfaces that you can see at any time such as dashboards, door jambs etc. The floor top and bottom and boot cavities can be done with black/grey /whatever acrylic etch after all epoxy priming of the important surfaces is dried and complete. You will need a 6 litre pack of epoxy - thats three litres of reactive thinner and three litres of primer. I use PPG DP40 or PPG Delfleet. The later is half the cost and is great at filling rust pits etc as its a high build epoxy. Downside is its designed for trucks so drying times are very slow and it very watery to use. Upside is if you can spray well its the better product due to its hi fill properties. You will need two -three good wet coats of Delfleet or 3-4 good wet coats of DP40. The latter - DP40 dries a lot quicker so panels can be handled sooner. You may speed things up with UV lights - but if you do - use UV lights through every stage here after including bog work. I like to bake parts in the sun which is essentially the same as UV lights but not as important to follow through with later stages.

4. Allow all epoxy primer to cure for 24 hours. Dont do bog work or other coatings until 24 hours above 18 degrees C has passed. Etch priming is done at the same time as the epoxy priming - but only after it (the epoxy) has tacked off enough. Epoxy is designed to be coated directly over without abrading first - however I like to go over it with a red/maroon scotchbrite as this gets into more places than sand paper will. 240 dry is fine also.
Bog is applied directly over epoxy - not bare steel. Dont panic if you have a little filler over bare steel - just minimise the bog over bare steel if you can. Once all bog work is done finish it off with 240 dry. Bog can be shaped using 36 or 40 grit then 60 and 80 grit. 240 must remove all deep scratches at this stage.
Never rely on primer to fill deep scratches. Over time it will reappear as paints do shrink into scratches - no matter how many coats you apply!!!! The scratches will appear 12 months after painting. Some high quality jobs actually get a rub down and repaint with a flow coat 12 months later to address this issue. The use of UV baking facilities will minimise that shrink back issue.

Off to work now - more later. Cheers streetneat -Andrew.

i'm glad you're keeping this brief, i'd hate to sit down and have a long conversation with ya :P

Just booking myself a seat, this is very interesting :)

Hmm - failed on the brief - but aiming to be concise. - I thought that was being brief!

righto - where was I ?

5.
Body work is best done with the object in mind of panel beating isnt bogging up repairs. However the body side of things is far too involved to cover here so as John Cleese said to his wife in Meaning of Life- "We will take the foreplay as read shall we?"

Metal repairs are given a coat or two of epoxy at the end of each day's panel beating. The surrounding area to be patch primed should be prepped with 80 grit on the orbital sander in an area larger than is to be primed. This gives the subsequent bog work over your metal repairs something to bond to. Once all the beating and major body work is out of the way the bog work can begin. Its at this stage you will final trial fit all your panels to be sure your bog work lines up with adjacent panels. Get used to the concept of your panels going on and off the car dozens of times if required.

6. with all your panel beating out of the way the bog work is applied over the epoxy primer - some slight keying with sandpaper is OK but not totally necessary - just good practice. When you are sanding your bog work you will end up with bare steel around the edge of the bog work. Dont stress - once again at the end of each day re prime these areas again with epoxy. When the bog work is complete on the whole car and all areas sealed with epoxy again its time to give the whole car a light rubdown with 240 grit - re adress any areas that need it now and then three to four coats of spray polyester over the whole car can be applied. Its at this stage that some get it quite wrong and expect the polyester to be doing the job of the bog work. Spray polyester is sprayable bog. Its designed to fill and blend - not fix bad bogwork finishing. The idea is to blend all your repair areas into one uniform surface with spray polyester. This is not a shaping stage - you were supposed to o that with your bog work!

7. Spray polyester is blocked back using a file board as much as possible. In expereinced hands bodywork is enhanced at this stage- in the wrong hands it can make a big mess. Long strokes of the file board - remember this stuff is soft and you can quickly dig grooves or low spots that will screw the whole job up.

I start by using 60 grit and knock the peely finish of the spray polyester off. I then progress to 80 grit being sure to be crisping the body lines as I go. I use a graphite powder guide coat system. I prefer it over painted guide coats as it lubricates as you sand where as painted guidecoats just add to paper clogging. The disadvantage of graphite powder is that you can remove it quickly - yet not sanded enough of the spray polyester. Each time I step up a grade of paper I re guide coat being sure I have removed the previous sanding grit scratches. Patience is the key here. I finish off with 120 grit.

Now is the time to break out the meths. Give the whole car a real good wash down and wipe it off while its still wet. DONT use wax and grease remover! Bad move if you do as it soaks straight into the polyester and can come out again to play when the car is painted.
Its very imperative you get all traces of polyester sanding dust of the car now - especially in grooves in body work. If left it will cause paint bridging in the final paint job a few months after the car is finished - not a good look!. Paint bridging is when the paint lifts in grooves and forms a blister.

7. Epoxy primer is now applied to the whole car again. Its not imperative - just good practise as it seals the whole lot of your bog work up again. You can just go straight to two pack hi fill primer if you wish. I insist on re epoxy priming and you will see why later. Keep away from any acrylic etch areas with the epoxy primer.

8. Two pack priming. I use and recommend Debeer tintable primer. I got over the fear of mixing brands - there is no such thing as true paint warranty with paint companies anyhow - we tried this out with one major company when their product clearly failed on one of my own cars ( clear went yellow in one big patch on my FC Ute and we used only their products) The company wormed out of it with feeble promises despite acknowledging their product had an issue. They gave me 1 litre of free clear but didn't offer anything else whatsoever for the redo.

The first three to four coats of tintable primer is tinted to an approximate colour of the final paint. The last two coats is tinted lighter or darker - your choice as the final colour may require.

Now is the time to rust proof - with strict control not to get any on the surfaces to be primed.

9. Strip the car of all its panels. Priming now commences. The shell is primed and all the panels inside and out individually. Some seam sealing can now be done if you are concerned about water getting into certain seams. I use a sprayable grey sealer but apply it manually with a finger. Clean up is done with prepsol ( wax and grease remover).

Time for tea - more later.
Cheers streetneat-Andrew.

nm

-back to it again - hopefully this time I wont lose the whole page of typed out tips....fukitol 'oh dear' I said....

10. The under body and floor pan inside the car can now be given its final coating of your choice. I prefer to use a water base stone guard followed by a stain black 2 pack paint on the underside. Body colour in two pack can be applied to the floor on the inside if you wish for it all to be a nice uniform colour. Before you do any of this - go nuts with seam sealer on all seams top and bottom of your floor pan. You will spend hours with a finger full of goo and a rag with prepwash on it. Loads of fun! Not a good time to come inside and use the phone or computer - so stay out there until its done. Don't get this goop everywhere or let it cure on panels to be rubbed down. Don't use sikaflex, silicone sealer, no more gaps, liquid nails or any other incorrect sealer - only use the proper automotive paint seam sealer. 3M make a good one - but there are a few European brands that work well too.

11. The inside paint surfaces like door jambs and dash etc can now be wet rubbed with 400 wet followed by 800 wet. The outside can be wet rubbed with 400 wet only at this stage. Masking commences - refer to my albums for this in better detail. (HG Ute album is a good start or current jobs in the shop album. Yes you will make a mess with water inside the car. Make sure the drain plates are out and keep plenty of water flowing to wash out the sludge build up. If water restrictions apply to you - you are in trouble now as you will go through plenty of water. A water blaster uses less water but in the wrong hands will cause problems with lifting of primer etc.

12. Painting of the insides commences. Be sure to soft edge mask the outer surfaces and use plenty of masking to prevent paint from going everywhere. All that should be exposed in your painting environment is the item or surface area to be painted- absolutely nothing else should be exposed! This keeps the contaminants down like dust and makes for a cleaner job. Prep the inside with wax and grease remover followed by a really good wipe down with metho. Metho removes water born contaminants like sweat and the rings from where you sat your cuppa or beer. A sheet of automotive plastic masking is best for draping over the car shell on the outside while you paint the inside bits. Be sure to have it properly held down with tape!

13. The removed panels are wet rubbed with 400 wet on the outer surfaces. The inside gets the same treatment except its finished with 800 wet. The panels are left to dry, masked and the insides painted - being careful not to get excess on the outside. One tip is to paint the whole of the door frame the window sits in now - inside and out. If you do this make sure the outside of the door frame is also wet rubbed with 800. I like to do this to make life easier for getting paint in where it counts. Many painters often dont get enough paint in these window channels. Paint the whole inside of your doors - not just the bits you see once the door card is in place. Paint the insides of your mudguards - where the bolts go on the top, the wheel arch lip and the inner part where the door closes and underneath where the guard bolts to the sill area. Doing these areas now means less headaches with painting later as you know you now have coverage on the hard to get bits. Soft edge masking applies here too.

14.
The panels can now be final wet rubbed with 800 and refitted back onto the car. If painting in a direct gloss solid colour carry on with the final wet rubdown with 800 - taking off any excess paint from the interior painting that escape your masking. Now is the time to pay attention to how much rubbing you are doing. If you break through the outer tinted primer thats OK - dont stress. You will see the different coloured primer underneath and you know you have three to four good coats of primer before you hit epoxy primer again. Now if you missed the epoxy primer stage after rubbing down the polyester - now is the time to reflect why did you miss this stage and go straight to hi build tintable primer? Its not a good idea to get your bog work wet - spray polyester is bog - so dont get it wet. Bury it in epoxy primer before applying two pack primer and you will be fine.

14.a. If you are using a COB - Clear Over Base system - be sure you dont break through the edges of the clear coats exposing the base coat while wet rubbing if you can help it. Some brands of paint will react with this edge and you will have a fry up.
This is why I like to mask off the outside surfaces when painting the insides - it makes life so much easier not having to rub off overspray on your precious outer surfaces. It also helps avoid the potential fry up issues.

15. Now you have painted insides and wet rubbed the outsides and all your panels are back on the car and gapped correctly. Time to spend a day masking. Before masking wash the car with regular soapy water using dish washing detergent. Don't use your wash and wax car wash - you are just putting wax on top of your primer! Not so good for a silicone free paint environment. Now is the time to shoot anyone that comes near the car. Bodies and blood can be removed with water. Contaminants from curious humans can not be removed if you dont see what they are doing or where they are doing it. Sweat, deodorants , sticky fingers and all the stuff humans consume must be kept well away.
If you must involve outside help to push the car around to its final paint position - insist on watching them wash their hands with plenty of natural soap or a good hand wash.
Make sure they havent been sweating or rolling in the dirt if they are going to help you mask. Cleanliness from now on is paramount to your paint job. Keep WD40, Armor All or any other obvious silicone bound materials well away - in another building.

16.
The car is masked - the floor is wet down and you are in a spray booth. With the booth running blow the car down with an air nozzle and palm it off with a nice dry hand. Prepwash can be used - only use a top shelf white spirits type especially formulated for automotive painting. Wipe systematically being sure to remove any remaining paint rubdown slurry. Don't let the prepwash dry - change the new tee shirt type rags constantly and only use a new rag out the bag. If the rag leaves your hands and is put down - get a fresh rag. No excuses. Now repeat with plenty of metho. This last step will go some way in removing some of the greasy deposits from the wax and grease remover - but will also remover water/salt/ mineral crystals left behind from the wax and grease remover wipe down. A final wipe down with a quality fresh tack rag will pick up rag remnants and fluff. Use the air as a final blow down over the entire car taking care not to bring dust out of potentially dusty places. Once again all that should be exposed is the surfaces to be painted- nothing else. Drop masking and back masking is essential and unconditional. Refer to my albums once again to see how this is done.

17.
I will skip the whole spray painting saga. My task here was to show you whats involved with preparation. The procedure here after painting is to flow coat in my opinion. Remove all the panels again and repeat the final paint procedure taken from the last priming stage. If a car like a GTS is to striped, the car is wet rubbed with 800 being careful not to cut through the paint. Lines are marked out and panels can now be removed or you can carefully back mask and paint the stripes on the car while it still wearing its panels. This is a procedure best figured out on a case by case basis. The prepwork is still the same.

18.
Once flow coating is completed - all panels can be buffed off the car if desired. This helps with keeping compound out of where you dont want it. Once again refer to my albums here. I dont buff the entire painted surface - I just de nib the inclusions out only. If the surface is that full of crap- the its wiser to flowcoat in my experience. Applying more colour or clear is dangerous on individual panels off the car - so be sure everything gets the same coverage.

19.Colour sanding can start with 800 grit in some cases - as long as you have loads of paint on the car! Normally I will start with 1200 or 1500 and finish with 2000.
Buffing of tow pack is best done while it's fresh and less than 24 hours old if it hasn't been baked. Soft paint will buff a lot easier than hard paint. I wont go on about being careful- that goes without saying. There is a whole new topic on buffing I wont go into here.

20. That's all folks. In short to quickly answer some of the other questions:

Aluminium can be stripped via chemical dipping if its powdercoated or painted. Specialist companies will do this for you. Anodised aluminium - well good luck - find the appropriate aluminum anodizers who wants to do car parts and let the rest of us know.

Metallic paint is different in that its a COB paint system. read above. It has to have a clear coat applied within 12 hours of the basecoat going on. One sneaky way around this is to add a little 2k hardner to your basecoat if you are worried about time frames.

Cheers streetneat -Andrew.

just marking thread.

Me too.

cheers Andrew