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Help - Fuel siphoning into carbi story

Hey guys.....

I have finally put the inlet manifold back on the HZ sedan (253 - Automatic) yesterday with new gaskets after having taken the inlet manifold off 6 months ago.

Being that no fuel had run through the fuel hose in a while, I needed to spray (flammable) carbi cleaner into the carbi (WW stromberg) a few times to help get the engine started, considering efforts at pouring a little petrol into carbi wasn't sufficient with pulsing the ignition on & off. I got the car started and went for a short drive down to the main street to put in fuel, as the tank was almost empty and stopped at my local servo for 5 min. as I only wanted $14 of fuel (@ $1.25/L = cheap uni student :) and to quickly clean outside windows.

The car was a little difficult to start back up, which needed cranking the ignition a few times while pumping and then holding accelerator pedal down. As I drove from the pump, another car tried to exit the servo at the same time although I was in front slightly, we both stopped and of course my car stalls however it started after 4 odd cranks of ignition. I drove home without having to come to a complete stand still because of a break in the traffic, therefore no stallage.

Later on this afternoon, while reversing out of my driveway a car turns around the corner, so I stop before getting out onto the road and my car stalls. It takes a couple of turns of the key to fire up again, which I then drove just around the corner to my mates parents house, turning off the car for 15 mins. until he was ready to go to the gym. It took several cranks of the ignition before we were on our way to the gym, with a notably smooth drive all the way and I gave the throttle a few squirts trying to find that sweet spot when it (overdrive?) kicks in.

We finish our workout and enter the carpark. I start my car up after a few cranks, pedal work and we drive off. I decide to take the long way home onto a stretch of freeway to give the engine a bit of a light workout, which there was no traffic so I was able to find that sweet spot that is around the 60 - 70 km/hr mark and ride it out to 110km/hr. My mate suggests the 'S' on the auto column possibly stands for 'sport' as in drive mode and we test it out, this seems likely to be true. I don't know what 'L' stands for either, as I've always just used 'D' for drive regardless of hills, towing or sports style cruising etc.

We turn off at the second Western freeway exit onto the outskirts of Melton.

Anyway the T part or top of the column shifter wasn't fastened with its single screw and my mate pops it off during our testing of the 'S' gear. We pull over, leave the car in idol, while we hop out and hunt for the spring. Of course, 30 seconds in the car stalls. A few minutes have gone by, I manage to find the spring and put the gear lever back in place, then try to start the car, though it was only cranking over and not starting. My mate preemptively states I've flooded it and hops out signalling me to pop the bonnet, takes off the air cleaner lid and cups his hands over the carbi while I crank the ignition in short bursts (to save my newly charged battery), though car won't start. He shines his iphone camera light into the carbi bowl and gets all hysteric about how fuel is siphoning into the carbi. I hop out also and kindly shove him aside to inspect the problem being my car and all. Sure enough, there was fuel siphoning into the carbi, a lot of fuel flooding both of the carbi bowls, let's say a couple of centimetres deep.

As usual, I act all calm and collected but internally I'm stressed out, temporarily forgetting I have a Philips head screw driver in the arm rest storage, thereby proceed to take off the fuel line pipe by hand to stem the flow of fuel which cost me $1.25/L (lol)! We inspect the needle and seat, all seems to be in order, I suggest the issue may be gunk in the fuel line cramming the needle open, which I state (from experience) probably flushed out when the fuel hose was taken off. Then I recalled I had a screw driver, so I untwist the fuel hose and wind the pipe back onto the carbi, also connecting back the fuel hose, then I get in the car turning the ignition which I hold on as instructed while the engine cranks over until the engine has successfully fired and release the ignition.

Without having moved anywhere, the car is started after a couple of more attempts following stalling and flooding of carbi occurring again, as I was at one point standing outside of the car with arms in the window and not able to depress the accelerator. This sees a repeat removal of the fuel hose and cranking engine with hose off to drain excess fuel. We reconnect fuel hose and I decide to see for myself what is happening while my mate starts the car. We get car going once more and he holds the throttle down flat to the floor while stationary, revving the [Naughty Pottyword] out of my engine and I was not a happy camper. He suggests he will drive home, its clear he doesn't want to repeat the exercise and I strongly object; luckily for me the car does not stall in the time between him releasing the accelerator and me gently putting my foot down to locate that point of idol at which I'm well aware it doesn't stall.

I was quietly adamant this flooding is the source of my problems with this car all along for the last couple of years, involving stalling at idol. After this long winded story, I have three questions to ask.

What is the fuel flooding problem called when the engine is turned off, as I don't know how to describe it? But more importantly, How do I fix it? and If I don't manage to fix it myself due to lack of time, what type of person would be qualified to fix the problem?

Cause I don't want to stall ever again at a traffic light, so want to fix this once and for all.

Regards,

Jesse

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"What is the fuel flooding problem called when the engine is turned off, as I don't know how to describe it? But more importantly, How do I fix it? and If I don't manage to fix it myself due to lack of time, what type of person would be qualified to fix the problem?"

It sounds to me like you're getting Vapourisation ... http://holdenpaedia....

I say this because the Carb doesn't Flood when the Engine is running, so it can't be the Needle and Seat or the Carb would be heavily Flooded by the operating Fuel Pump.

You need to make sure the Fuel Line is run away from the Exhaust Manifold as shown in the link.

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T

My Shed

Holdenpaedia, they're the brakes Mate.

1. Carby cleaner usually stalls engines when sprayed down the carby
2. "S" does not stand for "sport" lmfao
3. Putting hands over carby is choking it. When a car's flooded do you choke it?

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L = leisurly

S = sports mode

D = dangerously fast

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"I say this because the Carb doesn't Flood when the Engine is running, so it can't be the Needle and Seat or the Carb would be heavily Flooded by the operating Fuel Pump."

i disagree. it depends on how bad the needle and seat is leaking.

just replace the needle and seat, while you are in the mood for testing remove the float and shake it around - does it sound like there is any fuel inside of it?? a crack or pinhole will allow fuel in which then of course makes it heavy so it doesnt shut the needle properly.

check/adjust the float level when you have changed the needle and seat.

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L= low gear
S= second gear
D= drive

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steve..
O.H.T.C. Original Member.
My Shed

Didn't HZ have an electric solenoid as a throttle stop ? Is it there ? Working ?

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Needle and seat aint holding the fuel pump pressure. Change it.

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dont put the selector into "N",that means numbnuts.

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WHAT? no gravy?

My first thought T was residual pressure in the fuel line holding the needle and seat open. What fink ye?

Cheers, Matt

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The Vapourisation Page shows a number of reasons for this type of problem which includes a rise in Fuel Pressure in the Delivery Line after Shutdown due to Underbonnet Engine Heat as well as the Float Level rising due to Fuel Expansion.

I think this is where the Milesmaster's claim to fame exists through limiting the Fuel Pressure.

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T

My Shed

Holdenpaedia, they're the brakes Mate.

Just learned something again, thanks T!

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A bit embarrassing, as my buddy and I noticed, it seems I'd put the needle in the wrong way and i had lifted the float up too high. Seems to not be flooding and only stalled twice so far, but was easy to start so I did check if the flooding was still occurring.

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Cheers

Jesse
ˈfiːnɪks/
noun
1. (in classical mythology) a unique bird that lived for five or six centuries in the Arabian desert, after this time burning itself on a funeral pyre and rising from the ashes with renewed youth to live through another c

Many thanks for the Feedback.

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T

My Shed

Holdenpaedia, they're the brakes Mate.

My last sentence was meant to say:

"so I did 'not' check if the flooding was still occurring."

No worries T, figure someone might do same thing as i've done one day, I will try have another drive and assess if the fuel still siphons or not.

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Cheers

Jesse
ˈfiːnɪks/
noun
1. (in classical mythology) a unique bird that lived for five or six centuries in the Arabian desert, after this time burning itself on a funeral pyre and rising from the ashes with renewed youth to live through another c

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