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Starter motor issues

My 6cyli vc commodore has starter motor issues. They are embarrassing me and driving me insane. I cannot work out how to fix it. I’ve been through 3 starter motors new and they all did the same thing. Tick tick tick when trying to start the car. I get out with a hammer bash the solanoid then it might start. I usually have to enlist help the when one taps tthe solanoid and I start it it starts first click normally. I ditched the new starter motors those smaller high torque types for a old original type. Bosch. Same [Naughty Pottyword]. I’m at tethers end with it. Surely not every starter I put in has a bad solanoid, please help me out before I run this piece of crap off a. Cliff or something.
Thankyou in advance
Grant

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after 3 swap outs i'd be suss too .. i assume you have a healthy battery ? are your battery leads in good nick ?
Not enough power to start the car goes "tick tick tick" too is why i wonder about power delivery.
I'm running an ebay starter and having zero drama with it but best starter is the original small bosch off blue motor if available.

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I’ve bought a good 650cca battery and new lead to go to starter I found that the relay (pictured) that’s been wired in gets hot to touch even when the car is not turned on, so I disconnected it. I guess it’s a wait n see game now to see if that might’ve been the issue if not then is am genuinely lost

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How's your earth from motor to chassis? Might be creating high resistance and symptoms you describe.

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If the starters are new then it is not the starters.
You cannot have that many starters crook.
Old cars = old wiring
If the starters bench test ok then look at either seeing an auto electrician or at the very least, run a new power lead from the battery or main starter pin to the incoming side of the fuse box, and fit a new relay at the starter.

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Surely a professional diagnosis and fix would have been cheaper than three new starter motors and a battery.
If the relay was getting hot there is clearly something wrong with either the relay or the wiring.
My first action would have been replacing the $15.00 relay with a quality Bosch if I thought it was dodgy before I spent $160+ on a new starter or three.
I put a new small Bosch High Torque starter motor in our EH with a relay about 5 years ago and have never had any trouble with it.
David

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Old is good.

I had a sparky look at it but everything tested ok, I think a lot of new sparkys / mechanics (technicians really these days) don’t wanna know or don’t know about these older model cars anymore I find most things I get ‘fixed’ by a ‘professional ‘I’m fixing it again a week later. I did replace the relay ( put a picture of the new one in a previous post here) but I’ve just completely disconnected it now due to it getting hot. To be fair the second starter did have an issue like it would throw out but spin like crazy without contact on the flywheel on occasion so outside of the ‘tick tick tick’ it also did that so that’s that. It wouldn’t have been three if if that didn’t happen. But I think disconnecting that relay altogether has helped I think for some reason it is a power drain more than anything else. Car was starting first click when I disconnected that so to be honest I have zero clue to why it is even there

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The relay is there so that the starter gets a full 12 volts.
With older cars you can a voltage drop through old, damaged, corroded, dirty or loose wiring connections. The lower voltage makes the starter work a lot harder.
David

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Old is good.

Yeah but I think in my case the relay is not right lol

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I reckon you have a bad earth to the block or a dud connection on the negitive usual colprits of tick tick or maybe Ive been lucky the last 4 0r 5 times, if the relay is getting hot when its off it must be wired wrong.
The relay was probably put there to hide from a voltage drop on the ignition (dirty old contact).
30 + feed most likely comes from the battery or the big + on the starter motor
87 goes to the starter motor switch terminal
85 the positive from the key (starter motor switch wire)
86 negitive (engine block or - battery terminal)

85 and 86 turn on the coil which closes contact 30 to 87 powering up starter motor.
a bloke told me to use Bosch relays with diodes across the coil on the car he didn't go into why.
first pick of relay diagram I could find
https://www.sparesbo...
ole mate said to only use those on resistive loads (lights)
https://tridon.com.a...

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You need to measure the voltage at the big starter terminal (not the big solenoid terminal) while you are cranking it. If you have less than 8.5 volts there, you need to work backwards and see where you are getting the largest voltage drop. It sounds like you have a crap engine to frame earth. You can install a temporary one by using both the positive and negative leads from your jumper leads.

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"If your car has quarter vents, a diff at the back, and was available with wind-down windows, you may talk to me.
Otherwise I am not interested. Amen."

As mentioned check earth and all wiring mate also check out the ring gear teeth as may have some well worn down by now?

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Cheers, Lindsay.

2464

Of the radiator support panel can cause problems.
Check that and if necessary remove the wire to support, scratch or sandpaper the panel and wire to bare it, then refit.

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Run a wire straight from the solenoid spade terminal to the +ve on the battery. See if it kicks over. If it does, and does it fine then you've got some +ve supply issue going from the ignition to solenoid on the startermotor. Easy to test if it's an earth. Run a jumperlead from the body of the startermotor to the -ve of the battery.

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I'd rather drive my old holden than a new ford!

Seems to be a good thing for helping stem the voltage drop, car starts pretty good, not perfect but haven’t had to tap the solanoid

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Last night not even an hour after posting my last comment the starter motor let me down I drove it like 20 km stopping twice once for a bottle shop and once for service station then I stopped to buy some Indian food snd it happened.. TICK TICK TICK!! Had to get a passerbyer to tap the solanoid and it started first click. I dunno.

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I ran a new earth wire from battery to the firewall and this seems to have sorted the issue
Car starts first click every click so far
Thankyou to everyone who helped me out
Cheers
Grant

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